Big, Happy Families
My friend Izzy alerted me to a two-part series in an Oklahoma paper about large families. In this case, large refers to families with a mother and father who have stayed married to each other and produced a clan of nine or more all by their lonesomes, though, with that many children, believe me, you are never lonesome. I have lost count of the times I have not only been asked, “Are they all yours?” but it has been followed by, “From you and your husband?”
The nice thing about the two stories by Chris Jones is that she (or he?) didn’t treat the families as if they were freaks from the circus sideshow, but she penned an informative and encouraging series about the realities of life with lots of children. One family is expecting its 10th child, and the father has a job which some would say justifies either a little planned barrenhood or a visit from a social worker to advise them of available government programs:
As the chief financial support of the large family, R.C., a window clerk at the Norman Main Street post office, said he and his family rely on their faith in God and hard work.
He said people ask him how he is able to feed nine children, and they wonder if he accepts food stamps or welfare. He does not. Strangers make comments about birth control, shake their heads and tell him they can’t imagine how he manages. Stares are not uncommon when the family goes out together.
That father is wealthier than a Rockefeller Republican, with a 13-year-old daughter who says she is “thankful for having the best parents a kid could have.” A couple of my friends, who see children as an asset rather than a liability, because they welcome babies into their wombs, have had folks say to them (or in their hearing) that God gave us brains and we should use them, i.e., using birth control is smart and not using it is dumb. Yet over and over the Bible tells us that to have many children is a wonderful blessing for a family and a nation, and that God’s wisdom is foolishness to the world.
For a deeper look into the ins and outs and idiosyncrasies of large family life, Vision Forum has just published a book about a real-life big family, the Arnold Pents, who did carschooling before carschooling was cool. Think about the debt we owe to the pioneers of the homeschool movement who put their freedom on the line to teach their own children, then be in awe of people like the Pents, who were the Lewis and Clarks of the homeschool movement, mapping the trail that the pioneers followed.
Even though that trail was mapped and blazed, it’s still the road less traveled, and having a big family to take on the journey is, despite growing numbers of growing numbers, a path few ever find. It is not an easy path, but it’s not just for spiritual giants who have life’s great problems figured out. It’s for humble folks who know that they can’t figure out anything without the help of their Father in heaven, who knows all the answers and provides the groceries for those hungry mouths and the strength for our weary arms.
October 27th, 2004 at 7:36 am
Carmon, I’m sorry that this comment is not about large families…but I would be interested to how you would reply to this blog post which gives all kinds of reasons not to vote for your Constitution party candidate. Do you think these are valid reasons? Do you know if they are even accurate?
Cyber Hugs!
October 27th, 2004 at 7:42 am
I knew I recognized the "R.C." in your entry, Carmon. Marcie Bullock is a fellow MOMYS from the MOMYS Digest (Mothers of Many Young Siblings). http://www.momys.com
I believe her signature line always mentions something like, "Happy Wife to R.C." or something to that effect. Neat.
October 27th, 2004 at 9:29 am
Samantha – I think most of them *are* accurate and other great reasons to vote for him! Regarding the personal family problems and DUI – I don’t know. How accurate are they? Did this occur before he converted to Christianity? If it was on ongoing problem of course I would be troubled but that article appears to presenting only one side of the story.
Carmon, I got the "Are they all yours?" question for the first time the other day. She had three also so I am sure it was not "the" question but it was funny.
This family has 13 boys and 1 girl – http://www.famteam.com/
October 27th, 2004 at 9:49 am
Over at the Happy Catholic, Julie writes about the topic of fruitfulness.
Being fruitful and multiplying is not just someone’s whim, it is a God given vocation!
Most people in our fallen world will never understand this calling.
)
But God does and He is to only One who really matters
Donna
October 27th, 2004 at 10:39 am
Samantha, I’d be happy to answer your question later today!
October 27th, 2004 at 11:02 am
My hubby and five little guys were walking around in a mall, when the comment "are they all yours?" came from a really nice lady! She had six, and now has many grandchildren to boot. She kept saying that it was really nice to see families like ours out and about. Sometimes it’s tempting because of logistics to remain in our car or at home, but it’s good for my children to see that they are not a burden to take places. As far as wisdom is concerned, my husband pointed out that the first display of "having a brain" was the fall of man. Eve thought she was just as wise as God, and could make decisions based on what someone else was telling her. No matter the cost, may we strive to stand on the word of God, which is the only true source of wisdom. There are times however that you wouldn’t stop to contemplate "is this God’s wisdom or my own attempt at wisdom?" Example: my child has a cut, do I put a bandaid on it?? You get the point. Regarding a subject as sensative as birth control, I would rather have someone tell me straight out that their decision is not the same as mine,..rather than to assume that my decision to not have birth control is due to a lack of wisdom.
October 27th, 2004 at 11:10 am
"As far as wisdom is concerned, my husband pointed out that the first display of ‘having a brain’ was the fall of man."
Brilliant!
October 27th, 2004 at 11:21 am
Hi Carmon
In reference to Samantha’s request, I would appreciate being able to read your refutations to Barlow’s discussion. I know it is time-consuming to distill all the issues. Scarecrow is over there adding comments. And today’s LewRockwell has an article about politicans’ lying, albeit in reference to Bush. I feel sure that Peroutka et al is misrepresenting things from time to time, especially if you are familiar with his press secretary. All in all, presidential races are tiresome….local politics interests me more.
October 27th, 2004 at 1:02 pm
I still remember when our oldest son told a local store employee that he wanted lots of brothers and sisters. The man told him that he needed to talk to his dad about that. To which my son replied, "No, I need to talk to Jesus." Out of the mouths of babes…
October 27th, 2004 at 1:15 pm
Having just found out my husband and I are going to be grandparents next year, I am made even more aware of the prevailing attitude that children are a "pain." Our oldest daughter got married in Feb., so of course the usual comments of "Already?" and "Don’t they want to wait?" assault my ears. And some of these people are professing Christians! The fact that she’s "only" 19 years old is bothersome to some, as well. Meanwhile, I happily do the math and contemplate the possibilities of watching our family grow as the Lord sees fit.
BTW, who is going to Texas, and when?
October 27th, 2004 at 1:36 pm
I read the link above that Samantha sent in and I will look forward to Carmon’s comments on it hopefully later today. It was very disturbing, especially the link about his two poor step-daughters. If this is true I would not be able to vote for him.
My husband is voting for Bush so I’ll either have to do that or not vote at all, which I may do. I’m not in favor of any of the candidates to be honest. I can’t remember a more ugly election-the militancy this time around is incredulous to me. I despise the thought of Kerry winning…but not quite as much as I used to. If he wins then I believe we will be in the beginning (or maybe not so beginning?) stages of God’s judgment on America. I’m very curious how next Tuesday’s vote will go…I’m actually kind of looking forward to it, rather than dreading it. It will be interesting to see what the Lord will do. I may not know until the last minute if I’m voting or not…and if I don’t, this will be the first year since I was old enough that I haven’t voted.
Not sure…not sure…
October 27th, 2004 at 2:56 pm
OK, ladies, I’m fighting off a case of the flu (one of the hazards of living in a big, happy family!), but I’ll do my best to address this now. If there are any other questions or if I miss something, let me know.
First, let’s get the smear story out of the way. Mr. Barlow links to a nasty story about the Peroutka’s family problems, and he gives this story as one reason for not voting for him. I addressed that issue at great length on Jon Luker’s website where it is being discussed. I find it ironic that so many are granting credence to the allegations in this weekly liberal rag, not knowing any details other than the slanted story offered there. Also, the same folks discount the countless stories of the shenanigans of the Bush daughters, the president’s past substance abuse and the mystery surrounding the first lady’s manslaughter charges, all of which are well-documented from a wide variety of news sources.
Now for the rest of the "reasons" not to vote for Michael Peroutka, though many of them, Pieter and I agree, are reasons TO vote for him:
He’s the second choice: So what? When the third presidential election went to the House of Representatives because nobody received the majority of electoral votes, it took 36 votes before they agreed on Thomas Jefferson.
League of the South endorsement: This doesn’t bother me, and there are all sorts of reasons various groups endorse a candidate that have nothing to do with that person (or their party’s) acceptance of that group. What about the Log Cabin Republicans who have been courted by the Republicans who want the support of the homosexual lobby despite their claim to support the traditional family?
Never held elected office:: So what? Neither did Arnold Schwarzenegger before becoming governor of CA, and Ronald Reagan was only president of the Screen Actor’s Guild before he became governor and later president. In fact, I see this as a plus as he’s probably going to still retain a lot more principles than a career politician.
DUI: He got a ticket, never convicted. This doesn’t mean that he is a lush who flauts the law and drives drunk, it means he got stopped once and a breathalyzer said his blood alcohol was over the limit (which is not hard to do). What does this have to do with anything, especially considering that Mr. Barlow is supporting Bush who has admitted do being an alcoholic?
Free trade and import taxes: Paleoconservatives understand that the "free trade" with other countries is a sham as all those other economies are propped up by their governments and there is no real economic competition. Policies which help preserve American industry and jobs, and do not prop up foreign economies (with a trade imbalance) at the expense of our own are necessary to keep our country from being totally gutted. Soon the only industries we will have left are military imperialism and entertainment.
Eliminate national funding: When the president takes his oath of office to protect, preserve and defend the Constitution, I guess Peroutka takes it seriously. Where in the Constitution does it say the national government is to fund (through forced taxation) anything except the defense of our country?
37 state ballots: If he is on the ballot in your state, then he’s a viable choice. The Constitution Party is growing and if their policies are right and the Republicans are moving away from the issues which Christians support, then vote for them. If we don’t support the Constitution Party, then we really won’t have any choices in the near future because there won’t be any conservative conscience calling attention to the issues.
Foreign aid and peacekeeping: Amen. Read Washington’s Farewell Address and the Constitution, and explain to me why we ought to tax Americans to provide welfare benefits to other countries.
Franklin Sanders: He is misrepresented (as is his book, wade through Barlow’s comments). I do not equate Franklin Sanders with these men, but does the fact that Strom Thurmond (who ran for president with the State’s Rights party in the 40s) and David Duke (a prominent KKK leader) are Republicans discount any support for the Republican party? Some Democrats would say yes.
Immigration and amnesty: Amen. Once upon a time America had a much more-restrained policy on immigration, and we were picky about who and how many, knowing that unrestricted immigration was bad for national security, harmful to the economy as many immigrants would expect government assistance and unhealthy for a unique American culture as too many would expect to bring their religions and languages and cultural distinctions without assimiliating into this national heritage and culture. Now we have virtually unrestricted borders (with some known Chechen terrorists crossing the southern border this past summer) but an ephemeral, unconstitutional war on terrorism far away, which is escalating out of control.
Judicial review: So? He’s a strict constructionist as far as interpreting the Constitution. It’s because of judicial review that we have Roe v. Wade.
Social security optional: Please!!! Everyone knows that it’s about to go bankrupt (if not already), and even Bush has talked (briefly) about privatizing it. It’s optional for congressmen, and it should be for everyone. It’s another unconstitutional shell game.
No help for Israel: This falls under foreign aid. Yes, it’s a volatile area, but mostly because of our support of Israel (I do not agree with dispensationalists on this) and the West’s tinkering with the tribal disputes in that area. As for oil, if the Middle East doesn’t sell it to the United States, who will they sell it to? I don’t think there’s much worry about continuing to get oil from them, though we need to be aggressively pursuing other places to obtain oil rather than relying on the Mideast.
Constitutional purist: I guess this means that Mr. Barlow prefers Bush’s hypocrisy when he places his hand on the Bible and takes his presidential oath. I prefer following the law of our nation as it was set forth by the founders rather than an antinomian stance which allows for any tyrannical megalomanic with a winsome way to persuade a majority in the mobocracy to vote for him as long as he gives them enough bread and circuses.
There’s my Prairie Muffin punditry. It may be laced with a bit of sarcasm due to my weakened condition, but I tried to answer forthrightly and give some detail to buttress my positions. I welcome any questions as the election is now drawing close. I do not think this is "the most important election" any more than any other. I do think it’s time, however, for Christians to unplug their ears when real problems with the current president and his party are brought to their attention. Michael Peroutka is just a man, human and flawed like any other, but his positions most closely represent the intent of our founders as set forth in the Constitution. The current administration has gone far beyond flawed, and the Republicans will continue down that path as long as Christians continue to support and encourage them.
October 27th, 2004 at 5:44 pm
Hey! I didn’t know we had all of those large families in Oklahoma! And so close to Norman, too…I wonder where they go to church (if they do)? I love hearing about big families, and I can’t wait to have one of my own!
Carmon, thank you for writing about Mr. Peroutka. Oklahoma doesn’t have him on the ballot, so I can’t vote for him, but I was interested to hear an explanation of Mr. Barlow’s comments. It never ceases to amaze me how people get so worked up about politics–to the point of insulting fellow believers. Kinda brings you back to the real world, doesn’t it?
October 27th, 2004 at 6:32 pm
Susan, I was 18 when I got married and 19 when we conceived our oldest. (We weren’t using birth control but God saw fit give us a little over a year before I got pregnant.) I am glad that God was gracious in giving us this path – it is terrible to see ladies who have bought into the lies of late marriage and then several years of birth control and then find themselves infertile when they want a child.
Was someone talking about Texas? We are probably moving near Houston next summer.
October 27th, 2004 at 6:44 pm
Thanks for the refutations. They are concise and to the point. I just get so frustrated with the mudslinging. Next on my list to investigate is judges. Since judges dont have a voting record like congressmen/senators, sometimes it is more difficult to discern their positions on issues. I get to vote on state constitutional amendment defining marriage and a county amendment to allow liquor sales (or not).
Carmon, I hope y’all feel better soon
October 27th, 2004 at 8:21 pm
The flu.
Please forget the old blog and take care of yourself and your crew. I don’t think any of us will mind.
October 27th, 2004 at 8:25 pm
Well, Sandpiper, I may take your advice this evening. Susan: Pieter, Muffin Mix #1 and I are going to the film festival in San Antonio in a couple of weeks. We get to be VIPs
. Needless to say, we’re very excited. I’m going to see if I can get my liner notes for Gods and Generals autographed. We’re also going to get some inspiration from the Alamo and Davy Crockett’s memory as a reminder that "lost causes" are worth fighting for.
October 28th, 2004 at 9:51 am
Hi! I’ve been lurking about this site for a little while, and I really enjoy it. I always like reading about other large families. We have 8, age range from 12 to 6m. We just (well a year ago now) joined a Reformed church where we are not so unusual in our family size and it’s so nice to be invited over to folks’ houses for dinner again!
About the flu… I remember hearing an interview with a lady on Focus on the Family who had 20 or so children and folks were asking her questions like "how much laundry do you do?" I wish I could have asked "How do you keep them all well at the same time?" It seems like things just go round and round…. I hope your family will all be well soon! kerri
October 28th, 2004 at 12:44 pm
Even sick you did an outstanding job, Carmon!
Let’s not have knee-jerk reactions–ie. the Confederate Flag and Peroutka, etc. May we be thinking Christians not reactionary Christians.
May you all feel better and enjoy your time in San Antonio!
October 28th, 2004 at 2:31 pm
I live in OKC and know 3 of the four families. What was so great about this article is the reporter went out of her way to be nice to the families and to make this a positive article. The Oklahoman is the paper that wrote this and they tend to be pretty conservative. There are a number of large families in Oklahoma and while not everyone is open to it…most are very encouraging and friendly to Home schoolers.
October 28th, 2004 at 3:08 pm
Coming from a family of nine children I remember many times when my mother would pull up to a stop light and the people in the cars around us would start counting us. We knew because they were pointing at us. Of course, that was before the days of carseats and seatbelts so we were tumbling all oer the car, but I recall bing so embarressed at the people pointing to us. Now I think it’s funny.
October 28th, 2004 at 7:42 pm
San Antonio!?! Are you driving?
October 28th, 2004 at 8:12 pm
"San Antonio!?! Are you driving?"
That’d be cool, but no, we’re flying. We bought our plane tickets yesterday.
October 29th, 2004 at 9:12 pm
Get well soon Carmon. I’m looking forward to reading your thoughts about the film festival. A lot of the films look very interesting. By the way, I received those two books today. Thanks.
Blessings